attitudes to students

Little Miss Midwife · #**101** (**permalink**) 16-Jul-2008, 15:40

God I am bricking it now. I want to do this profession so badly but now I am thinking if this is how students get treated I am better off working in a supermarket and being a mum to my kids without the misery. However saying that I will not give up without a fight and will do my best to make my sons proud after all I am doing this all for them.

elliesmummy · #**102** (**permalink**) 16-Jul-2008, 15:41

These threads are sad to read:-( Do these nasty midwives forget that they too were once students??

I can understand the stress and pressure on midwives these days but it doesn't take much to speak politely to people does it?? If it were me, I would be proud to be a mentor, to see the midwife progress and go on to become an excellent midwife her/himself, my mum loves mentoring students in her job (she's in mental health)

I'm just wondering, what would happen if you were to speak back to the nasty midwives?? Not in a bad way just for example take them to the side and tell them that you don't appreciate the way they are speaking to do etc?? It is so sad that students dreams, everything they have ever worked for is being ruined because a midiwife is "having a bad day" :-( forgive me for being naiive, I use the word nasty as I know there are some excellent midwives out there who are more than happy to help stuents progress. I have never worked with midwives etc but reading all about the bitchiness etc and the way it is driving potentially excellent midwives out of the profession makes me so sad.

x x x x x

TallPoppy · #**103** (**permalink**) 16-Jul-2008, 15:44

Theres no need to 'brick it' as you say, Tanya, and this has never meant to put anyone off.

This thread is about some peoples experiences and even then they still love what they do.

This isnt the profession.

This is a problem that needs solving.

Elliesmummy - yes we would encourage all students to talk to the person who has upset them first, as there will usually be a good explaination - however in some cases where communication has broken down there needs to be other processes to follow. Thats what this thread is about. Finding out what the issues are, acting on them and putting processes in place to deal with them. I would say all Unis have procedures for dealing with such matters, but many students arent aware or are too scared to make a fuss so it continues until in some cases students become ill and or leave..

This is to break that circle and that silence.

midwifemissy · #**104** (**permalink**) 16-Jul-2008, 16:58

This is exactly the point J, I am sure every student wants to be told when they are doing something wrong, or could do it better a different way, I know I would. But, as you say it is HOW you are told that makes the difference.

I for one feel vulnerable on the wards, and at the mercy of the staff I am working alongside. To then be spoken to like I am an idiot, or yelled at, just crushes what tiny bit of confidence I may have built up that day.

Originally Posted by J™

There are may situations we will or have found ourselves in and we may have not done something right and felt 'told off' but this isnt bullying, although there is a way of advising someone how to do something they are not sure of or are having a first few goes at.

Its about respect.

In my view there is a line and you know when that is crossed.

kookiebob · #**105** (**permalink**) 16-Jul-2008, 17:43

Originally Posted by Tanyaj72

God I am bricking it now. I want to do this profession so badly but now I am thinking if this is how students get treated I am better off working in a supermarket and being a mum to my kids without the misery. However saying that I will not give up without a fight and will do my best to make my sons proud after all I am doing this all for them.

Don't let this thread put you off midwifery!! I am truly having a tough time on this particular placement but not enough to make me quit - not by a long way. If anything it makes me more determined to qualify and to be a great midwife. It's important as a prospective student to realise that it is a tough course but if you are passionate about midwifery the highs totally outweigh the lows - so if you are passionate go for it - the profession needs you

Thanks for all your supportive replies, I am due a review with my mentor and I'm going to talk it through with her and in the mean time I'm going back to my next shift with all your kind thoughts in my pocket to see me through.

Norman · #**106** (**permalink**) 16-Jul-2008, 18:18

I agree with the comments about not putting up and shutting up - ok it does us no favours at the time - but they want us to be assertive, confident practitioners - and thats got to start somewhere and long term it'll be better for us and future students.

If your wrong - put your hands up and say so - but if they're just being horrid - you also need to put your hands up and say so - and if you have to do it 10 times before anyone listens - well you'll just have strong arms into the bargin!

If uni is a bit rubbish in there support - go to the union - most of us are members - and that is what they are there for!

Thats me done soapboxing again! At least for a few minutes!

Dory · #**107** (**permalink**) 16-Jul-2008, 18:29

Originally Posted by midwifemissy

This is exactly the point J, I am sure every student wants to be told when they are doing something wrong, or could do it better a different way, I know I would. But, as you say it is HOW you are told that makes the difference.

I for one feel vulnerable on the wards, and at the mercy of the staff I am working alongside. To then be spoken to like I am an idiot, or yelled at, just crushes what tiny bit of confidence I may have built up that day.

I find that, if my student has done something glaringly wrong, I usually don't need to tell her. Once we have left the room I ask how she thought she did and she usually knows what was wrong and why, we chat about it, and next time she does fine. I don't think there is any excuse for shouting at a student and making them feel small in front of others - in the same way that I wouldn't intentionally do that to any other colleague. But in general I have found students to be far more critical of their own practice than I would usually be, so to talk through the what and whys and plan for next time is a far more positive and productive way forward. And it helps my student in their development into a reflective practitioner, which can only be a positive thing.

midwifemissy · #**108** (**permalink**) 16-Jul-2008, 18:43

Very true Dory,

I usually know if I have done something wrong, and I am the first to admit that, and I have worked with mentors who have discussd it with me afterwards, and I really appreciate that. Much better than being made to feel small in front of the woman and family, or other midwives.

Originally Posted by Dory

I find that, if my student has done something glaringly wrong, I usually don't need to tell her. Once we have left the room I ask how she thought she did and she usually knows what was wrong and why, we chat about it, and next time she does fine. I don't think there is any excuse for shouting at a student and making them feel small in front of others - in the same way that I wouldn't intentionally do that to any other colleague. But in general I have found students to be far more critical of their own practice than I would usually be, so to talk through the what and whys and plan for next time is a far more positive and productive way forward. And it helps my student in their development into a reflective practitioner, which can only be a positive thing.

Esperanza · #**109** (**permalink**) 18-Jul-2008, 22:04

I think as a student you have to learn to be very adaptable very quickly and also grow a very thick skin!! At the end of the day I tend to remind myself this is a relatively short period of time (although it doesn't always feel like it!) and I will be able practice my own way at the end of it (evidence based of course!). Besides you learn even from the poorer mentors - how you don't wish to be in the future yourself! However I agree there should be a system in place to weedle out the bad ones....

Bunny · #**110** (**permalink**) 19-Jul-2008, 04:59

I understood that even if midwives were not sign-off mentors part of their role involved supervising students. I've not the time to find the NMC thingy that says so though!

I've mentioned somewhere already (forgive me if its the same thread) that I was assigned a mentor who was bad at that job, but also a bad midwife. And I mean bad, as 2 women complained to me about her on one shift. I went to my tutor and said I don't think she should have students, and it turns out she'd already been 'banned' due to something that happened years ago. She's now really banned! I still feel guilty that I didn't stand up taller, and register the complaints that those women made to me - I honestly do not think she's fit to practice.

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