Lets spice the easter break up a bit.... we've almost talked about this a few times, so lets cut to the chase.

Supernumerary... are we?

Are we low paid/unpaid extra pairs of hands?

Do you feel we prop up the midwife shortage on the wards?

Are you getting the learning experience you want?

Is it just part of learning, getting stuck in on the wards?

Share you views here....

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J
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Oooooh J ™,

Are you sure you really want my answer at the moment lol?

I feel we aren't supernumery a lot of the time, as it just isn't possible, on the wards at least. They are just too short staffed for us to be.

I do feel a lot of the time we are an unpaid pair of hands to do the routine things such as obs and run to other wards etc.

We definately (in my experience) prop up the midwife shortage on quite a number of occasions.

You know my thoughts on this one already, no, I didn't get the learning experience I wanted/hoped for.

I think it is all part of learning to get stuck in, but so is being able to learn skills, do new stuff that we haven't been able to do before supervised by a mentor on a regular basis during your placement.

I am quite happy to help on the wards wherever I can, but not at the expense of my learning.

Will it ever change? I don't think so sadly. But I hope I am wrong.

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Bless you Mum & Dad x
Student Midwife 2007

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I haven't really thought about the downside of being a student midwife.

I'd be interested to know more midwifemissy.

I'm prepared to start from the bottom up (that just sounds so wrong!). Is it really at the expense of learning.

Do you mean we will be kept so busy progression is not quite as good as it should be?

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overexcited http://www.studentmidwife.net/../../...t5_b/party.gif Can u tell?

Hi Chatty,

I can only say how it was from my own experience, not for all wards or placements, I know some people have loved their placement on the wards and got a lot from it.

I had quite a few problems whilst I was there, partly due to staff shortages, the unit being extremely busy to the point of being closed a few times, and also with continuity of who I was working with which again wasn't really anyones fault.

I feel that if these things had been different then maybe I would have had a chance to learn more, do more and as a result gain more knowledge and skills.

That said, I know I have become competent in some things that I wasn't before, and that can only be a good thing. But nowhere near as much as I hoped before I started.

We do have to start at the bottom, we are students after all, but that doesn't mean that midwives should be stretched to such a limit that we are not able to have the support and mentoring that we are entitled to.

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Bless you Mum & Dad x
Student Midwife 2007

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Educational Resources Manager

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I quite agree.

One of the things that I will probably find interesting after 5 children is why the midwives seem so unavailable. Crossing over to the other side is always an eyeopener.

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overexcited http://www.studentmidwife.net/../../...t5_b/party.gif Can u tell?

well, I definately havent always been supernumary however i don't really think that this impacts on my learning experience in a negative way, quite the opposite, it enhances it!

It means, I am able to develop my confidence with women without feeling like i am being watched all the time. If I need to know anything i will always seek out my mentor who will help and come and check what i need. At the end of the shift i always go home and write down anything that has happened that i didnt understand and will always ask the next time i go in for clarification of anything i am still unsure of.

I know there are some that think this could be unsafe as i am practising unchecked. But i dont see it that way. I have built up a relationship with my main mentor over a year, and she trusts my abilities to deal with 'the normal' and trusts that i will ask when i am not!

I know there are certain periods of time in the year that the unit doesnt have any students in, and i sometimes wish i was a fly on the wall! Midwives are able to care for 3 women at a time usually because they have a student. However, when they dont I just dont understand how the unit runs within safe parameters. It worries me!!

I have really heard both sides of the story as im sure we all have. The mothers complain that the MW's aren't around to help, and the MW's know that they aren't helping and supporting mothers as much as they want to, but can't as they are streched too thin on the ground. It is a viscious never ending cycle that will only be resolved when more money is ploughed into maternity services, or the litigation budget is cut and money not paid out for spurious waste of time cases.

As students although we are not supernumery i dont believe we are unpaid workforce either. We get an NHS bursary which as we all know does not go a long way, and is way below the minimum wage when all is said is done, but we do get paid none the less. I love being part of the workforce and going home each day knowing that i have made a difference to a womans experience of maternity services, and making a difference to the team i am working in that day by lightening the load as much as i can.

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It is good to know that you have had such a positive experience ollybolly, and as I said, I know that some students have really enjoyed their placements on the wards, and found them to be a very positive experience.

Sadly, for various reasons I wasn't so lucky. I didn't have a mentor for most of my placement and so had to work with different midwives, so had to explain what I had and hadn't done a lot of the time, and when the ward is really pushed and so busy that just adds extra pressure for both the midwives and students.

I agree, we do get a bursay, but that is a training allowance not a wage, so when we aren't receiving that training as we are meant to do should we be getting that at all?

I know some of the things I was asked to do was so the midwives could get on and do other things, it made life easier for them to have students around to fetch and carry (so to speak) I am not complaining about that, just making a point.

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Bless you Mum & Dad x
Student Midwife 2007

Student uni rep
Educational Resources Manager

Have you just been offered a place? If so and you want a mentor please post in post this forum (also post here if you would like a mentee)

hahaahah, wondered when we would crack open this chestnut!!

I just wrote a really long post and then deleted it by accident so this won't be so long, but I have to put my two penneth in...!

I have quite mixed views on this, whilst no we are most definately not supernumary, once again the theoretical ideal, in reality impossible. Just like normality on CLU's.

I think at a certain stage in your training and with a good mentor, this is beneficial to your training, being able to provide most care on your own is better and enables the sutdent to learn more and become more proficient both with communication and practical tasks.

Too early in your training though, and not being able to work with a mentor for a good amount of time to develop a trusting relationship means this won't work though. I have changed mentors (long story) and am now able to work much more cohesively, we get on well, I can go and do things myself and she knows and trusts that if I am unsure of anything, I will come to her and ask her to check. If not that things are ok. She does not use me to perform tasks and teaches me those things I struggle with when we are more able to find the time to.

We are a cheap alternative, the bursary does pay us a meagre sum but to live and learn to be a midwife, not to work, and maybe we do lose out to some respect, however IMO I do better working this way and feel it better prepares us for working when newly qualified.

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I agree with you there smwife, there have been times during this placement that the midwives have said thank god we have students on today as we are so short staffed! While it can be nerve wracking to be pushed in at the deep end at times like this I feel that I learnt a hell of a lot on those days, you just have to get stuck in there and I feel more confident without someone breathing down my neck all day. I sometimes feel daft when talking to mothers if my mentors present but when Im on my own Im much more relaxed. I know that if theres something Im unsure of that my mentor trusts me to ask her to check I wouldnt dream of doing something off my own back without asking her first. Having said that if everyday was like that then I think you can be in danger of not having the oppertunity to learn new skills as theres not enough time to be shown so its nice when there are quiter days too so that you have time to ask questions and progress. I feel like I'v come on leaps and bounds during this placement and had loads of really nice complements off midwives and mothers.

MM
I know you had a bad time, for which I am sorry, it jsut isnt nice sometimes. But when the place is busy why not just go off and do what needs doing! ( i really dont mean that to sound flippant, honestly) This means you are not going over the same ground day in and day out with different mentors. They will see what you can do and your ability to be proactive and practice within your limits, whilst at the same time getting the work done whilst taking the pressure off a bit.
Just a thought?
x

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