[goddessmomma]

In another part of the article in the BJM it says:

"Studies leading to licensing drugs for children are more difficult to undertake and the pharmaceurtical industry has little incentive to get involved with them. As a general result of this, children are not always guaranteed safe and effective medicines which should be their fundamental right (Lee 2006; Report on the Royal Society Medicine Forum. Midwives 9 (10). Hey noted (2003 - Vitamin K what, why and when. Arch. Dis. Child. Fetal Neonatal Ed (88): F80) , in particular regarding vitamin K preparations, that children's needs have little influence within the pharmaceutical industry.

Really sorry about the messy referencing but just not sure how to do it so that you could, if you wanted, further read up on it...

Well I should have gone to bed hours ago. Turned into a pumpkin and needing some rest. Nite xxxxxx

[Normal]

Originally Posted by RainbowGoddess GM, what a wonderful attitude your daughter has, that she wouldn't impose her views on others and would allow her children to make their own decision and not risk their health by forcing them to comply with her choice t be a vegetarian. She sounds as special as her mother is!

Just a quick point - I don't feel like I'm 'forcing' my girls to 'comply' with my choice to be vegetarian. Everyone eats vegetarian foods - some simply choose to also eat meat and fish. By omitting these items from my childrens diet - that is truely giving them a choice as their bodies have not been subjected to dealing with meat and if they do choose at a later date to eat meat - one thing is for sure it will be an informed choice.

[RainbowGoddess]

Originally Posted by Norman Just a quick point - I don't feel like I'm 'forcing' my girls to 'comply' with my choice to be vegetarian. Everyone eats vegetarian foods - some simply choose to also eat meat and fish. By omitting these items from my childrens diet - that is truely giving them a choice as their bodies have not been subjected to dealing with meat and if they do choose at a later date to eat meat - one thing is for sure it will be an informed choice.

Well we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, I always feel sorry for young children who are limited in their diet because of their parent's wishes and I actually feel that very young children need to eat meat or fish, I know there are alternate sources of protein but they are so hard to digest that children can't really eat enough of them

[Normal]

Originally Posted by RainbowGoddess Well we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, I always feel sorry for young children who are limited in their diet because of their parent's wishes and I actually feel that very young children need to eat meat or fish, I know there are alternate sources of protein but they are so hard to digest that children can't really eat enough of them

Red meat can be found in the system 8 years after it's eaten! I don't know of anything vegetarian that is nigh on impossible to digest like that? Also, what is the need? The vegetarian and vegan children that I know are far less fussy eaters than their meat eating peers - I'm not trying to make a sweeping generalisation here - I'm merely commenting on my own experience - and I whole heartedly believe this has a direct correlation to the variety of foods they have been introduced to as infants because more effort has to go into their diets to ensure it's well balanced.

My children don't need folks pity - they, and all the other children who don't fit into the box need folk to open there minds.

Anyway - this is now totally ! So, like you say - perhaps we should just agree to disagree on this one! x

[sassy]

My community mentors daughter refused vitK for her son on the basis that if his body needed it so much, then his body would produce it. I completely agree. I believe it should only be offered to babies that have a high risk of developing complications eg. ventouse and forceps.

My mentors daughter got lots of hassle from the hospital midwives and peads for not allowing vitK. Appaling!

And as for what it contains, women should be told this. It's the same with antiD. If women don't read the information leaflet, most would be unaware that it's actually a blood biproduct.



Sorry if I don't make much sense, I've not been up long!!!!

[goddessmomma]

[quote=sassy;70899]My community mentors daughter refused vitK for her son on the basis that if his body needed it so much, then his body would produce it. I completely agree. I believe it should only be offered to babies that have a high risk of developing complications eg. vontouse and forceps.

My mentors daughter got lots of hassle from the hospital midwives and peads for not allowing vitK. Appaling!

And as for what it contains, women should be told this. It's the same with antiD. If women don't read the information leaflet, most would be unaware that it's actually a blood biproduct.

You are making perfect sense hun. In the article it did say if refused the senior paediatric consultant should be called and I do believe provide the heavy sell tactic.

Informed choice is the buzz word, its recited in almost every midwifery book and journal you read, and along with informed choice is the need for all the information so that informed choice can be made!!! No good giving half a tail.

By the way I love the quote on your signature. I can just imangine having a pair of hands there. It would be great for when you had an itch. Much more discreet...xxxxx

[june]

Originally Posted by goddessmomma You are making perfect sense hun. In the article it did say if refused the senior paediatric consultant should be called and I do believe provide the heavy sell tactic. Informed choice is the buzz word, its recited in almost every midwifery book and journal you read, and along with informed choice is the need for all the information so that informed choice can be made!!! No good giving half a tail. By the way I love the quote on your signature. I can just imangine having a pair of hands there. It would be great for when you had an itch. Much more discreet...xxxxx

Morning all,
Informed choice eh?? Dont get me started on that one..... Basically in my experience it usually means 'coerced choice' as if a woman dares to do something other than what the experts advise her to do then she's putting her baby at risk. That or the information is given retrospectively - I've seen that enough times - hmmm.. I'll get off my soapbox before I really get started.

[goddessmomma]

I agree June. I think it is only the stronger natured of us who are willing to stand up and actually challenge and quesiton the reason for certain care proceedures and why thnigs have to be done because its always been that way.

I worry that if I am blessed enough to get the chance to be a midwife that I won't be popular amongst the staff because I wouldn't be able to stand by and watch someone being talked into something they don't want. Whether that is a vitamin injection or managed 3rd stage of labour.

If informed choice is what is branded about and at the front of many government directives then thats what the ladies should have; a choice...

Right June I've finished with the soapbox you can have it back now..

xxxxxxxxx

[ProteinQueen]

Can I have a shot of the soap box please!!! I completely agree with the idea that informed choice does not exist. In my experience, the (few) women who have actually researched what their choices are are always seen as picky and hardwork. I really hate this attitude and it is something that hopefully I will never take with me into practice. The midwives in my area don't ever talk about Vit K or 3rd stage in community and hardly anyone who comes into hospital in labour knows about them. I agree that this is not the time for a lengthy discussion to the pros and cons but surely it's unethical if it doesn't take place? If I were in labour and a midwife said to me "do you want a wee jag to help you deliver placenta" and then followed that up by "It'll be quicker and stop you bleeding" then I'd do it. Doesn't give a choice. Same with Vit K, Anti-D and any other informed choice issue. Ridiculous and I can't wait to be qualified!!

Who wants soap box now!!??

[june]

Originally Posted by smw81 Can I have a shot of the soap box please!!! I completely agree with the idea that informed choice does not exist. In my experience, the (few) women who have actually researched what their choices are are always seen as picky and hardwork. I really hate this attitude and it is something that hopefully I will never take with me into practice. The midwives in my area don't ever talk about Vit K or 3rd stage in community and hardly anyone who comes into hospital in labour knows about them. I agree that this is not the time for a lengthy discussion to the pros and cons but surely it's unethical if it doesn't take place? If I were in labour and a midwife said to me "do you want a wee jag to help you deliver placenta" and then followed that up by "It'll be quicker and stop you bleeding" then I'd do it. Doesn't give a choice. Same with Vit K, Anti-D and any other informed choice issue. Ridiculous and I can't wait to be qualified!! Who wants soap box now!!??

Me....!
Should be making lunch as DH will be back any mo now from shopping bless him but cant resist the call of the soapbox....
I am one of those 'picky and hardwork' women, currently pregnant with baby #4. You should've seen the mws reaction at my booking appointment when I said with baby#3 I hadnt had synto [I used to live in Edinburgh and can just hear that "wee jag" thing... making me homesick!!] or AntiD and baby hadnt had vit K. I'm certainly not having the antenatal antiD.

Its nice to be 'popular' on here as like you say GM I wont be popular in the big world of midwifery.... (maybe with the women themselves I hope!)
Soapbox free now.....